16v Mini Club Forums  

Go Back   16v Mini Club Forums > Builds > Other Non Mini Builds

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-01-2017, 07:04 PM   #1
M J W J
Senior Member
 
M J W J's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: telford/stafford
Posts: 552
Subframe: Home Made
CC: 1796
Make: Vauxhall
ECU: standard
Default Mike's Z19DTH Mk3 astra

I put this build up on another forum but unfortunately it has gone down and as I have a few people who keep asking me about it I thought I'd put it up here so they could check it out. I've been working on this for a few months now.

I will return to the mini once this is done.

First a little history...

My first car was a mini and was great until tin worm got the better of it.

Next was a Ford escorts which didn't last long. I hated it and when it came time to its MOT it failed spectacularly.

With the death of my escort I had to find a new car and unfortunately this was right when the scrappage scheme was in full swing. As you may well know if you tried to buy a car at the time, the market for second hand cars had been decimated. The cars available at the time were either complete scrap or were way out of my price range. Being 19 at the time I thought that diesel was the fuel of Satan and should be avoided at all costs so it might seam odd that I ended up buying was a mk3 astra 1.7 diesel gm low blow. While I didn't want a diesel it was pretty much mechanically sound and the few issues it did have I was able to sort out. It was this car that spawned the idea



3 years later, at which point I had graduated uni and got my first proper job, my engine decided to go bang. Literally. The water pump seized causing the pulley to shear scattering bits of metal all over the road and breaking the timing belt. I didn't have time to fix it and had too many other cars sitting round my parents so couldn't hold onto it.

This was a shame as up to this point I had fitted a GSI rear anti roll bar, 15" tigra alloys, GSI springs and poly bushes throughout. I had also began researching into possible engines to swap in, one in particular was the Saab Z19DTR twin turbo 1.9 diesel engine.

The replacement to the astra was a 1.8 petrol mondeo. Everything started going wrong on it after about 6 months and in the end I had to break it and sell it in parts to get rid of it. The only good thing about it was show me how much better diesels are for daily commuting.

Next came a Vectra 1.9 CDTI. Loads of people have tried to tell me over the years that the mondeo is a better car than the Vectra. Sorry but I've owned both and the Vectra was a far nicer car for day to day use. Better mpg, more comfortable, more powerful, a damm sight quicker and more reliable...

Well I say reliable (I had done a lot more miles by this point in the vectra than the mondeo so I still maintain the vectra is more reliable), unfortunately one morning on the way to work a rear wheel bearing failed causing the car to spin suddenly on me. I hit the only gateway along the road which spun me back round and as I slid down the hill in the field the car rolled twice landing on its passenger side.




As they say. Every cloud has a silver lining. As no one else was involved and due to my excess I decided not to claim and sell the car off in parts. I did however decide to keep the engine and everything needed to make it run. It may not have been the Z19DTR engine I was first looking at but it was the single turbo Z19DTH engine.

Still with me?

Roll on a couple of years and after buying my first house (and more importantly drive way) I picked up this beauty for 180 delivered. I think you can all probably see where this is going.


First the tear down.


C16se engine out


Dash stripped out as well


The key to making this all work is a Saab FM55 B14 or B13 gearbox (not sure on the difference so if anyone knows please enlighten me). This is basically a FM55 505 gearbox with a different bell housing. This is one if the gearboxes that is used for a B204 swap. This means drive shafts, mounts and gear linkage all bolt up.

Comparison between the gearbox bell housings. The B14 gearbox is the nearer one.


Only slight issue is that the diff is setup for 35 spline shafts which only the 900 viggen had. This meant a diff swap was in order(this also got me better ratios for the wheel size I am running)

One Mahoosive puller required to pull the casing halves apart.

Two gearboxes stripped down and laid out in order


Reassembly after a thorough cleaning


No need to buy specialist tools from Gm. Just grind your differential bearing's outer race from your parts gearbox to make the necessary spacer for setting bearing preload.


One rebuilt gearbox



More has been done and this isn't quite in order but I will post more soon
__________________
Where there's the will and a welder, there's a way.

Last edited by M J W J; 13-08-2017 at 10:57 AM.
M J W J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2017, 05:59 AM   #2
ardonfast
Senior Member
 
ardonfast's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: dunkeswell airfeald devon
Posts: 7,349
Subframe: AMT
CC: 2000
Make: Vauxhall
ECU: dizzy/webers
Default

twists and turns in mikes world!! worth more in a mad dog way,
__________________
"yuck ,more like a 3 r2"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=tb261HwQNDQ
SAY WHAT YOU BELEVE,,BELEVE WHAT YOU LIKE,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=3JhaTwP7uuk
ardonfast is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2017, 09:10 AM   #3
MattG
Administrator
 
MattG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: West Sussex,UK
Posts: 7,131
Subframe: Allspeed
CC: 2000
Make: Vauxhall
ECU: Megasquirt
Default

cool , cant wait for updates
__________________
Mini Restoration on YouTube
VW camper in storage , Red hot , www.16vmini.co.uk www.jetblackmini.co.uk
Dad's Building K1100 : bmw.16vmini.co.uk , donate to club running costs : paypal@16vminiclub.com
MattG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2017, 01:43 PM   #4
M J W J
Senior Member
 
M J W J's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: telford/stafford
Posts: 552
Subframe: Home Made
CC: 1796
Make: Vauxhall
ECU: standard
Default

Prior to stripping the gearboxes apart I mocked up the gearbox and engine in position to check that the swap was going to be possible.

With the FM55 B14 gearbox fitted to the engine, I fitted the half shaft I still had from the Vectra to check the centre line of the drive shaft remained in the same place. It did and my intention was to the Vectra support bearing with the Saab shaft however as I have learnt more recently this isn't going to be possible.



I tapped some threads in some existing bosses that weren't used on the B14 box, clearenced a web on the gearbox for an engine mount and then bolted up the mounts.


Getting the engine in is difficult. I have to drop the engine in from the top side then slide the gearbox in from under the wing and connect them together. It is a seriously tight squeeze in the engine bay.

(as far as I know the first time a Z19DTH engine has ever been in a mk3 astra)

(bolted in place on two out of three engine mounts)

(Saab 9-3 front mount)

(Saab 9-3 rear mount)

After removing a turbo pipe I put the bonnet back in place to see if it would shut and it does. Woo Whoo!!! It was at this point that a mate of mine convinced me to build this as a sleeper. This means that the faded paintwork is going to be left, the vectra instrument panel will be disguised in the astra dash and I will be fitting 15" steel wheels with tacky pound stretcher wheel trims.


The O/S mount is going to take a bit more work. Unfortunately there isn't a bolt on solution that I can find. I bought a Saab 900 O/S mount as it was the correct style and would just require me to build an L shape bracket to join it to the engine.

I spent the week after I bought it trying to figure out the best way to mount it and then is occurred to me. Both the Astra Mk3 and the Saab 900 are NG900 chassis meaning the front chassis legs are the same so armed with a battery drill and grinder borrowed from work I went back to the scrap yard and cut the parts out that the mounts bolt to on the Saab (easier said than done when there is a Peugot 206 sat on top)


Sacrificial Saab

Parts removed from the Saab

Parts cleaned up ready to be welded in place (I did strip the paint back and paint them in weld through primer after this picture was taken)

I then welded the parts in, painted them and fitted the Saab 900 engine mount.



The engine is very tight on the O/S so some small modifications will be needed before the engine goes back in


More still to come.
__________________
Where there's the will and a welder, there's a way.
M J W J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2017, 05:57 PM   #5
MiniLandy
Senior Member
 
MiniLandy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: nr Peterborough
Posts: 2,318
Subframe: Home Made
CC: 1400
Make: Rover
ECU: Megajolt
Default

Awesome build. Will you get away with shaving that mount down and fitting a countersunk bolt?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by apbellamy View Post
Fuck me Shaun. That actually made sense.
MiniLandy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2017, 07:51 PM   #6
M J W J
Senior Member
 
M J W J's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: telford/stafford
Posts: 552
Subframe: Home Made
CC: 1796
Make: Vauxhall
ECU: standard
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MiniLandy View Post
Awesome build. Will you get away with shaving that mount down and fitting a countersunk bolt?
Way ahead of you.

I trimmed the mount down and countersunk two of the holes.



One problem in doing this I found is that the bolts were metric fine thread. It turns out that countersunk M10 metric fine bolts finish at 90mm long and I needed one at 110mm and another at 150mm long.

Solution. Buy two normal M10 that were 180mm long, cut them to length and then retread them.




Next issue (out of about 100 to solve) was the power steering. The astra has hydraulic power steering with a pump run off the engine. The vectra uses an electric pump. In addition to this I want to run air con so don't want to ditch the air con pump.

I made a bracket up to mount the pump to the Vectra engine.




Due to the pulley size the pump will be running 11% quicker at idle but due to the lower red line of the Z19DTH compared to the C16SE fitted the pump will be running 6% slower at full speed. What this means is that it will always be running within its correct operating range.



To clear the engine mount casting another idler pulley is required. I choose the smallest I could from a GM car (I'm trying to keep it all GM) and machined a pin that mounts it in place of one of the engine mount bolts. Before purchasing it I decided to make a cardboard mock up to check it fitted. It was close but with some love with a file to the engine mount, it worked.


The pin I made and the bolt with miscellaneous nuts and washers used to figure out the necessary spacing.

I just need to find a longer belt now.
__________________
Where there's the will and a welder, there's a way.

Last edited by M J W J; 09-01-2017 at 10:13 PM.
M J W J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2017, 01:43 PM   #7
M J W J
Senior Member
 
M J W J's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: telford/stafford
Posts: 552
Subframe: Home Made
CC: 1796
Make: Vauxhall
ECU: standard
Default

Next some creature comforts.

Not only do I want the torque, power and fuel economy my Vectra had but in a smaller lighter car, I also wanted to keep some of the creature comforts such as air con and cruise control.

I managed to get hold of a MK3 astra GSI air conditioning heater unit so went about making the necessary holes in the bulk head to get it to fit.



For the cruise control I bought a Zafira A wiper stalk that had the cruise control button on the end of it. This clicks in place where the Astra one was. I will just need to figure the pin out and wire it into the Vectra wiring loom that will be transferred over to the Astra.



Pedals. To make the Vectra engine work I have had to use the fly by wire throttle pedal. After removing the pedal mount I made up a set of brackets and welded them to it so the pedal could be bolted in place.




(the brake pedal isn't connected in the photos)

The clutch I was hoping to be much simplier by simply fitting a cable operated set of forks from an F18 gearbox I have into the Saab gearbox. Turns out while a lot of parts can be swapped around and an almost identical position for the clutch slave pipe on the gearbox, this can't be done. After toying around with a few ideas eventually I decided to go with making a Saab 9-3 clutch master and pedal assembly fit.

On my first attempt it fitted fine. So did the first attempt fitting the heater but unfortunately they didn't fit together so a small piece was trimmed off the heater and the pedal mount assembly was modified accordingly.




Next was the gear linkage. Fortunately someone had already done all the hard work, figuring this one out for me. By using the Saab FM55 gearbox the gearlinkage from a Saab 900 and 9-3 simply bolts in place. I cut the part with the ignition barrel in it off the mount so it would fit under the centre console and then simply bolted it in place.


(yes that is my kitchen, it was raining outside when I was doing this)


Still a bit more to come
__________________
Where there's the will and a welder, there's a way.
M J W J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2017, 02:49 PM   #8
InstantCustard
Senior Member
 
InstantCustard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Whitworth, Lancashire
Posts: 5,371
Subframe: Home Made
CC: 1.8
Make: Rover
ECU: Emerald K6
Default

Loving this!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Burnard View Post
couldnt be bothered to stretch that far to pull it out.
InstantCustard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-2017, 09:13 PM   #9
InstantCustard
Senior Member
 
InstantCustard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Whitworth, Lancashire
Posts: 5,371
Subframe: Home Made
CC: 1.8
Make: Rover
ECU: Emerald K6
Default






Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Burnard View Post
couldnt be bothered to stretch that far to pull it out.
InstantCustard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2017, 02:07 PM   #10
M J W J
Senior Member
 
M J W J's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: telford/stafford
Posts: 552
Subframe: Home Made
CC: 1796
Make: Vauxhall
ECU: standard
Default

Radiator setup.

I had hoped just to use the Vectra radiator/intercooler/aircon setup but after a few measurements I quickly realised it was never going to fit. This meant another trip to the breakers.

I settled on a Zafira B radiator from a 2 litre diesel along with its air con radiator. I didn't take the inter cooler due to the position of the pipes as they would have clashed with the slam panel on the Astra.

After removing the bumper, grill and headlights, I drilled out the spot welds and removed the front bar. I cut down the one support grommet and drilled another hole to put an o ring in which the lower pegs on the radiator would fit into.






I then made up some aluminium brackets with yet more rubber grommets in them and bolted the top of the radiator to the existing radiator mounting points.




To get the air con radiator in I had to do yet more surgery. There is space between the top of it and the back of the grill so I will go back at a later date and make a reinforcement piece.



For the inter cooler I first tried fitting a Saab 9-3 diesel one which didn't work. After some research and almost giving in and buying a Skoda diesel inter cooler, I came across a small unit from an Astra GSI Z20LET. The inter cooler has aluminium end tanks so I can cut the pipes off and get a mate of mine to TIG weld on some new pipes in the correct position. By turning the inter cooler on its side I can get one of the pipes to clear the radiator and line up quite nicely towards the inlet. Unfortunately I don't have any photos of the inter cooler. I will post some when I get round to fitting it properly.

Like everything else the fitment is really tight so some trimming to the back side of the bumper is in order. Fortunately this just hides behind the grill.

__________________
Where there's the will and a welder, there's a way.
M J W J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2017, 01:37 PM   #11
M J W J
Senior Member
 
M J W J's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: telford/stafford
Posts: 552
Subframe: Home Made
CC: 1796
Make: Vauxhall
ECU: standard
Default

Odds and ends. This is the last post before I am up to date.

Vectra's run canbus so to make everything work I am transferring a large proportion of the loom from the Vectra across to the Astra. One reason for doing this is that the Saab gearbox I am using does not have a speedo drive or sensor output to run the speedo. The engine also requires a speed signal so this will be taken from the ABS sensors being fitted. As I am transferring the Vectra loom I am going to use the Vectra instrument panel but mounted into the Astra dash.

Some trimming was required.



I made up some aluminium tabs and epoxied them to the instrument panel so it would mount via the existing Astra instrument mounting screw. Unfortunately since I have taken the photos the glue has broken so I need to figure out a new way of attaching the brackets I made.


Here is the instrument panel with the bezzel back in place.


Clutch

Despite the FM55 B14 gearbox being designed to fit the Z19DTH engine it has a different number of splines compared to the more commonly used M32 or F40 gearboxes. I took the clutch friction place with the FM55 505 one I bought for the diff however the 505 gearboxes uses a sprung clutch friction plate where as the Z19DTH uses a dual mass flywheel.

When I went to the auto factors, I was met with the 'what's your registration' question which was of no help. After explaining to them its for an engine swap, they then proceeded to tell me I must have a 6 speed not a 5 speed as that is all that there system had listed. Considering this engine and gearbox combination is used in the Saab 9-5 I am a little surprised. I ended up leaving both auto factors empty handy and on the search for a clutch.

After a lot of research, messages to various people on ebay and at breakers yards (most of which never replied) I managed to find a friction plate that fitted both the Vectra flywheel and diaphragm yet had the correct splines for the gearbox. In case anyone needs to know its from a 2.0 DTI engine in a mk4 astra with F23 gearbox fitted.



Suspension. I did quite a bit of suspension work to my original Astra and I want to continue experimenting a bit. I've heard of people using Saab lower control arms as it gives them a little more negative camber. Additionally as they are ally they save me some weight on the front of the car. I have unfortunately had to use a Saab 9-3 front anti-roll bar which is thicker than the Astra's. I may look at changing this at a later date.



Finally I bought this little lot. I hadn't originally planned on going 5 stud but I managed to get a good deal on the lot. I needed to change the front drive flanges to match the drive shafts and I needed to fit ABS sensors to all wheels to make the speedo work. I've benefited from less rear sprung weight now I have swapped to discs, more reliable rear brakes (drum self adjusting mechanisms on mk3 astras all fail at some point, they did on my last one) and I now have 288mm front discs, a big improvement over the original 240mm ones.



I've fitted the rear hubs and test fitted my new Cavalier steel wheels. Just need to sort the hand brake cable out (they are different lengths depending on whether you have drum or disc brakes) and get some tyres fitted. The front struts will be swapped in one the engine is back in place and I sort the drive shafts.

__________________
Where there's the will and a welder, there's a way.
M J W J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 13-01-2017, 09:12 PM   #12
gouldy847
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Bielefeld Germay, Oswestry (ish) Measham Derbyshire
Posts: 620
Subframe: Other
CC: 1800
Make: Rover
ECU: MEMS I THINK
Default

Well this is kinda cool!!
gouldy847 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-01-2017, 04:32 PM   #13
M J W J
Senior Member
 
M J W J's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: telford/stafford
Posts: 552
Subframe: Home Made
CC: 1796
Make: Vauxhall
ECU: standard
Default

Small update.

After 6 attempts I finally got the correct size auxiliary belt. A big thank you to Priorslee motor spares who kept exchanging them for me.



I've also started looking at the half shaft. As mentioned in a earlier post, I intended to use the Vectra support bearing and just machine a collar to take up the difference in shaft diameter. The problem with this is that the Saab 900 shaft I'm using is shorter so doesn't fit into the gearbox properly when passed through the Vectra bearing.


The drive shafts are aligned at their bearing's to show the slight difference in length.

The Saab shaft is hard up against the Vectra bearing support and still isn't inserted properly.

This is the start of a custom bracket to support the half shaft. I need to spend some time with a lathe again to make a holder for the bearing. This will bolt to a plate, which will also retain the bearing in place and therefore the shaft, and then be tack welded in situ on the engine to ensure the shaft is aligned properly.



I've also just spent the afternoon playing with my eBay special tig welder. After finally getting it to work its not bad. It should allow me to make up the exhaust and necessary intercooler piping.
__________________
Where there's the will and a welder, there's a way.
M J W J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-01-2017, 08:48 PM   #14
M J W J
Senior Member
 
M J W J's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: telford/stafford
Posts: 552
Subframe: Home Made
CC: 1796
Make: Vauxhall
ECU: standard
Default

I've continued with mounting the Saab half shaft so spent a couple of evenings machining a holder for the bearing. The plan is to drill and tap this so it bolts to a bracket that bolts to the existing holes on the back of the sump.



I've also replaced the original astra pump with the much larger one from the Vectra's tank. It was a bit of a squeeze but I've managed to get it to fit and have reinstalled it into the tank.


(again working in my kitchen as it was cold outside)

I removed the tank a few weeks ago, drained as much petrol out of it as I could and have left the remaining drop to evaporate which it has done. Once fitted back in the car I will put a couple of cans of diesel in it and run the pump to flush the system out.

My friends Alex and Dan thought it was funny how I used a scrap piece of cardboard to write the list of things needed to be done. I had to introduce them to roadkill on YouTube to explain why I did it. The list is getting shorter.



Refitting my tank will allow me to do quite a few jobs on the list.
__________________
Where there's the will and a welder, there's a way.
M J W J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2017, 09:39 PM   #15
M J W J
Senior Member
 
M J W J's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: telford/stafford
Posts: 552
Subframe: Home Made
CC: 1796
Make: Vauxhall
ECU: standard
Default

I did quite a lot last Sunday but didn't take many photos so will try and get some more tomorrow afternoon once I get back from work.

I spent most of the day working on the half shaft bearing. I first had to make a large hole for the shaft and circlip to go through. This required stitch drilling and then a lot of filing. Once done I lined the bearing holder up, clamped it, drilled and tapped it and then bolted them together.





With this done I prepared it for welding as well as the plate that was bolted to the sump shown in an earlier photo. Once prepped I lined them up and tack welded them together (used my new tig welder). Once tacked together I dismantled it all and removed it from the sump to fully weld. Sorry no photos. Also I need a lot of practice tig welding but I have to say I love the control it gives you.

Last night I removed both front suspension legs from the Astra. I had hoped to strip them apart as I need to use the springs and top mounts on the Saab struts. Unfortunately my strut spanner can't currently be used on the Astra struts. It's worked well on all other cars but the design of the Astra struts means it can't be used this time. Not to worry. Tools have been ordered and if necessary the strut spanner will be modified yet again.


(behold! The strut spanner!)

I managed to get the track rod ends off as well and without splitting the rubber boots. This never happens when I work on mk3 Astra and Saabs. I usually end up having to undo the track rod end from the steering rack, break the gas axe out and then replace the track rod ends.

Tonight I replaced a rubber boot on one of my Saab lower arms. Normally I would be suspicious of ball joints with split rubber boots but in this instance I was the numpty who split it so know it's fine and I don't want to have to replace a lower arm as you can't just replace the ball joint on the Saab arms. Fortunately I could pinch the rubber boot from one of the Astra's lower arms and fit it to the Saab one.



Finally I swapped the outer CV joint on my cavalier drive shaft. This is so I have the Abs ring needed for the speedo. God I hate drive shafts!



My dad is coming over on Sunday to help. Hopefully we can get the car to the point where I would just need to bolt wheels on and it would roll again (I need to buy tyres for the steel wheels I bought)

__________________
Where there's the will and a welder, there's a way.
M J W J is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 07:50 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.