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Old 28-03-2011, 02:07 PM   #16
Birdman
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lol - tempting tho it is i dont want it to be quite that obvious. Radiator might end up being mounted in the rear bed tho if i run out of space in the front (I figure if Z-cars can run rear engine front rad, I can run front engine rear rad). Altho this will not be a complete sleeper the engine in the front would be nicer.

Out of interest do you think I could get away with running this on 10 x 7 force racing split rims? Or are they gonna end up being way too small? Seen other redtops on 10s before.
Depends upon what you are intending to use the car for, but 10" wheels with a C20 LET is possibly going to be a bit undergeared and have a smaller tyre footprint.
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Old 28-03-2011, 02:12 PM   #17
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Yeah I did wonder that. I can go to 13s if I need to. Just love the look of the 10s. Its only going to be a toy so wont need it everyday but might want a cruising gear in 5th.
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Old 28-03-2011, 03:05 PM   #18
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There have been many discussions on here in the past about the calibra/cav 4x4 system.

As has been said, it's a pretty pineapple system to begin with, not to mention large and heavy. Give it a go if you feel up to it - but you may find out why there are none (as far as i'm aware) that have been completed. May also be making it hard for you to fit it all in the rear of a pickup and still keep it sleeper.

10" is do-able, and like you say there are a few out there running on them. Brakes will become an issue, especially at the back with the FWD drive setup.

Have you considered running an LSD and just having FWD? If you set the car up well (suspension geometry, and weights) then you should really be able to get the power down. I remember talking to Bill (BadMonkey on here) about his redtop mini with an LSD and he was saying that he struggles to get his to wheelspin since fitting it!

(oh and bear in mind that the rad up the front and engine in back works well as that's where all the air is hitting! )

Definately get some pics up of your progress if you go down the 4x4 route, would be great to see someone tackle it.
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Old 29-03-2011, 10:24 PM   #19
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As has been said the Vauxhall 4 wheel drive system is rubbish, don't waste your time with it, also the transfer box is mega heavy, about as heavy as a gearbox. The F28 is not any wider than an F20 but it is deeper at the back so will interfere with the mini steering rack if kept in its original location.

If you're going FWD and are leaving the C20LET standard i.e 205ish bhp then you could just use an F20, an LSD is prefered, in fact before you even think about spending any money on tuning parts for the engine I would get an LSD first. Its far better to get the car handling well first and getting the available power down before buying any pub talk 300bhp blah blah tuning widgets etc. An F28 is about 300 secondhand and an F20 is about 50, so you could break 6 F20's for the cost of one F28.

My last 16v mini was an 2.0XE with around 220bhp (itb's,cams etc), FWD with an LSD in an F20 box, the box took that power with no issues so should be ok with a standard C20LET as long as you don't go daft increasing the power and torque too much. The car handled so much better with the LSD and any wheelspin was dramatically reduced.

Having had a 200+bhp mini I would'nt be running it on 10" wheels!! You will need as big a brake kit as you can fit under 13" wheels really, and as wide a tyre as you can fit. The XE motor is a big heavy lump and you will have the added weight of the C20LET's turbo, intercooler + pipework etc. Have a look at Matt G's build dairy on his Vauxhall 1.6 turbo build to see how crowded the frontend will get.
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Old 29-03-2011, 10:34 PM   #20
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Scrivs, just my 2 penneth !! I ran a 4x4 calibra back in the day that was fantastic until the transfer box failed.....like they all do, as it says earlier in the thread you have to rotate the tyres constantly so they wear equally.....a pain on a daily driver, maybe not so bad on a hobby mini..

There is a great compromise that I keep reading about in 'Total vauxhall' which is a set of locking rings for the transfer box - no more worries of it failing but it would be fixed at a 50:50 front:rear bias. What I dont know is how much of the hydraulics you would need to maintain, on a calibra the power steering and 4x4 system are all linked together, so you would need to work that out too.

hope thats of some help, i'd go for it if you can stop the worry of a busted transfer box, fixing it aint cheap !!!!! Andy
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Old 30-03-2011, 08:44 AM   #21
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Thanks for the responses. If its possible to sort the transfer box issue then I'm still tempted to have a go! Locking it off so little or no hydraulics would definately be preferred. There should be less strain on the drivetrain as its not pulling such a heavy car as well I hope. This may sound a bit of a silly question but is the transfer box mounted so that the propshaft runs down the centre of the car as I couldnt work out where it went in relation to the gearbox or how it got its drive. Will the allspeed driveshafts still be usable or am I going to need some different length ones due to the transfer box?

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Old 30-03-2011, 10:41 AM   #22
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This link has a lot of info on the calibra 4x4. I thought that a lot of owners who had problems with their 4x4 systems, just removed a fuse and put the car in 2wd mode. If this is so you presumably can save wear and tear on the rest of the system and then just switch on the 4x4 when you want it. But of course still having tyres evenly worn all round would still be important when sitched to 4x4 mode.

http://calibra-classic.org/docs/C20LET.pdf
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Old 30-03-2011, 10:48 AM   #23
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Wow just looked at that info myself - that should be enough to scare anyone off - LOL. Removing fuse F19 seems to disable the 4x4 mode.
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Old 30-03-2011, 10:53 AM   #24
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Changing the lock rings will not make it a 50:50 split, it just removes the need to use hydraulics and actuator that controls power to the rear when braking, it doesn't change the viscous coupling that is responsible for actually sending power to the rear. Also, don't believe everything you hear, the turbo transfer box with lock rings is very strong, most the issues come from the hydraulics and not looking after it.

The F20 isn't made to take the abuse that the F28 will take, you can tell by the size of the layshaft !! F20 will be toast when the torque kicks in, although you could argue that the car is a lot lighter than the calibra/cavalier. the transfer box for the turbo is also larger than the NA 4x4 on an F20... i have both so i know the f20 + smaller transfer box will not fit either without bulkhead mods and rack relocation.

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Old 30-03-2011, 03:23 PM   #25
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Just had a look at your build diary mininut an that looks ace! Just got to find out if i can fit the f28 into the allspeed frame (with little or no modding) or if im going to need a new frame like you've done.
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Old 30-03-2011, 03:26 PM   #26
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Just had a look at your build diary mininut an that looks ace! Just got to find out if i can fit the f28 into the allspeed frame (with little or no modding) or if im going to need a new frame like you've done.
I hope you are good at fabricating..
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Old 31-03-2011, 10:40 AM   #27
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Just got to find out if i can fit the f28 into the allspeed frame
I'm pretty sure not, the diff casing is HUGE, dont chop it up too much else you wont be able to sell it if you need to make another.

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Old 31-03-2011, 03:56 PM   #28
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hi i looked at using the vauxhall 4x4 but after lots of research, all my answers pointed if you want awd go honda or suzuki.

i was told by numbers of people that on the vauxhall setup you have to rotate the tires round so they all wear even, the transfer box is very heavy.

i went honda in the end.

http://www.16vminiclub.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=23396
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