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Old 07-03-2009, 03:41 PM   #1
bobjonah
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Default Swift Elf G13B build

Hi all..

My father and I have taken the plunge and decided to upgrade our '69 Riley elf with a 16 Valve Suziki Swift GTI powerplant..

We originally restored our Elf in 2006 and have had a few great summers cruising the backroads of Atlantic Canada. We've even had a go at the hills of Sunday River in Bethel Main , the car performing admirably. Sadley however the original 998cc , even with the tweaks we have made, has just not given us the overal performace we would like to see.

And so our journey begins. Some might say its a little late in the winter months to really start a build and hope to have the car back on the road in time for spring. Hey we are in the maritimes and it snowed just yesterday, I figure we have a good few weeks before that stops and roads get a few good rinses to wash the winter nasty off them

Besides, how hard could it really be to fit a 20 year old motor in a 40 year old car

We'll keep you posted on our progress and I'm sure we may have a question or two for the group as we really get into it...

Here is a link to our original build of the car back in '06 and we will post new build pics as we go..
http://riley-elf.blogspot.com/

Cheers!
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Old 07-03-2009, 04:57 PM   #2
pickup76
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sounds like a cool project! I love elfs and hornets but a 16v one is even better

Have you seen the vtec elf? http://www.16vminiclub.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=15165

Chris
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Old 07-03-2009, 09:01 PM   #3
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Yes, I did see this one - very nice job. I wonder what that Honda engine weighs. I chose to do the G13B based on it's light weight and right hand bias which allows me to retain my original radiator placement. I do not want to do any irreversable modifications, as the Elves and Hornets are seriously rare in Canada - only 4 or 5 in all I think. We should have a few photos to post tomorrow.
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Old 07-03-2009, 11:00 PM   #4
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NICE!

Welcome and good choice of an engine!
I wanted to have Elf or Hornet for long, long time.
What mk of engine are you going to use?

You should become a member of Teamswift and redlinegti.
They can give you many good advice for either NA or Turbo.

Keep us posted with your build!

Cheers
Atchi
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Old 08-03-2009, 02:15 PM   #5
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Thanks for your interest - I have read your build as well and find it very informative - bits of genius here and there.

I believe the engine is a Mk2, from a 1990 model. When Greg gets here later today we will try to post a few photos.

I do not want to modify my bulkhead for intake runner clearance if at all possible - has anybody attempted tipping the intake up and forward? I have looked it over and think it can be done by milling the mounting flange at a different angle and bending the support brackets - any thoughts / comments on this ? I am left hand drive so do not have the master cylindres to contend with on that side.

The other area that concerns me is clearance between the transmission and the steering rack, as I want to mount the engine a bit to the left hand side, so the cam belt cover is not sticking into the inner fender on the right. My drive shafts will most likely come out at 335mm and 305mm rather than 320mm each if it was centered.

Cheers
Bob Jonah
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Old 08-03-2009, 06:26 PM   #6
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Back at it today, time for a few Photos.

This first three are the frame Jig with simulated bulkhead across the towers. If we can clear this we are laughing.








The final three are of the motor. We beleive its a MK2 but if you can spot otherwise let us know





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Old 08-03-2009, 06:43 PM   #7
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Nope, thats definitely a MK2. I like the idea of simulating the bulkhead and Im not sure if your going to but you might aswell simulate the front valance aswell.
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Old 08-03-2009, 07:17 PM   #8
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Yes we will be simulating the front valance, as well, we are going to simulate the fender profile. That , hopefully, will save us a bit of frustration when it comes time to do the final fit.
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Old 08-03-2009, 10:34 PM   #9
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Hi,

Yes, that's mk2 alright.
You can tell by looking at 2 things.
1, your gearbox has a black steel cover for 5th gear.
2, your cambelt.

I think you can do away with off-setting your engine without modifying(cut) inner wing. If you look at Smarfy's build, you can see well.

Also, I don't think you need to modify bulk head, too much. Since you don't have master cylinders. You can even use a hydro clutch setup, so you don't need to worry too much there.

For your steering rack, wise. I have some people mounted onto front subframe itself. So, I don't know if you can do that or not.

Anyway, good luck and keep us informed. It looks like you know what you are doing from the jig you made!

Cheers
Atchi
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Old 23-03-2009, 12:02 AM   #10
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Quick progress update from the build..

Progress has been slow the last couple of weeks. But we have managed to get some work done on the subframe. We are quickly learning how extreemly tight a space we have to work with. The steering rack is one spot we may have some issues. Being left hand drive we are running into some interferance with the gearbox. Another minor concern is the number 1 cylinder intake runner interfering with the bulkhead... One thought we have had is to plane the intake manifold flange a few degrees to allow a bit more wiggle room. Has anyone tried this? Tips? words of caution? We have a spare intake manifold and can test with that. If it doesn't work out its not a big job to modify the bulkhead anyway.

Here are a few more pictures of the subframe with a first attempt at squeezing the motor into place. We've simulated some of our critical bottle necks and will hopefully have the positioning sorted out and subframe finished by next weekend.








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Old 23-03-2009, 01:21 AM   #11
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Looking real good !

One thing we have done is add a gearbox filler plug onto the pressed metal gearbox end cover.. the OEM filler plug is a PITA to get to when its in the subframe.

The steering rack was mounted to the subframe on my kit car.. bolted to two 6mm thick x about 40mm wide straps that were bolted to the back of the subframe. It worked really well, unfortunately I don't have any pics, and Pete sold the subframe

Will you be able to change the oil filter? Our solution was to make the front of the subframe lower than the filter, but it does mean the subframe is visible below the valance. Its not a big problem with a removable front as a section of the subframe can tuck into the valance... One other possibility is a bolt in section around the filter, that you fit after the subframe is in place...

and what's that pink stuff ? I've been dying to ask

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Old 23-03-2009, 08:54 PM   #12
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What about a remote oil filter?
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Old 24-03-2009, 11:33 AM   #13
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Hi Spiyda:
Thanks for the great tip on the filler plug - had not even considered that yet. Do you know what level to mount it. If not I can figure it out.
Is the Mk2 diff case different than the Mk1? Mine seems to be larger than most photos that I have looked at. I suppose that clearance here is not an issue with RH steering? The "Pink stuff" is painted markings - letters and numerals and dobs on some of the bolt heads - I have not attempted to decipher it yet and I do not know the purpose either. They may be production markings OR the trans may have been replaced by one from an auto salvage yard, and the markings may be the auto salvage control numbers.
I think that I have enough room right now to change the filter as it is. I do not want to use a smaller filter, so if I cannot change it, I will put a remote filter and oil cooler. Good clean oil and lots of it is what I like.
I have a spare intake manifold, so I am having the mounting flange milled at a different angle to provide better clearance at the bulkhead. This should allow me to tip the engine to the "magic" 5 degrees and give me better clearance at the steering rack. I should only have to modify the accelerator cable mount if all goes as planned. This will take a coulple of weeks tho, as my son in law ( machinist ) is away on vacation right now. Any input on this is VERY welcome .

Bob Jonah
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Old 24-03-2009, 12:42 PM   #14
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It was virtually impossible to get at the original plug

We couldn't get the new filler plug low enough to act as a level plug, so I just welded a nut on as low as I thought I could get away with on the casing... the plug is just a short bolt with a fibre washer.

To fill it we pour in the measured amount with a funnel and tube.

Where we have it, there is a hole in the casting behind that the tube slips into.. you'll see it when you get in there... makes the filling faster..





Clearance on RHD is still an issue... it's a tight fit whatever...


Pity we are UK and you are Oz... we have several spare manifolds you could have a play with

I have looked at it the manifold situation when we first started..and was going to cut a section out of the runners rather than machine the flange... the metal is just about weldable with a MIG, Argon and ally wire if you don't have TIG ..... however, we decided to go ITB then supercharger, so I have made the manifolds from scratch.. ... the problem is not as bad for you LHDs so if you can get away with just machining the flange, go for it !
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Old 15-04-2009, 12:53 AM   #15
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Default What would Homer say ?

DOH!..

Time for an update. Progress has been slow to date but finally had the subframe ready for a trial fit. Motor mounts installed engine fits at the magic 5 degrees. Gave up on tipping the manifold and have modified the bulkhead instead. The wisdome of the web holds true!















So tonight we attempted our first trial fit of the subframe into the chasis. We now realize why everybody else takes the front off the car.....










This thing won't fit in one piece Any Ideas??? Has anyone ever attempted a two piece frame?
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