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Old 22-06-2016, 03:21 PM   #1
Mini91
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Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 4
Default Lightweight track toy

Hey guys.

I'm thinking about building a lightweight track and street racer next year. Main use would be 50% twisty roads and 50% track/hillclimb/slalom use. Weight should be under 650 or even 600 kilogram. Power to weight ratio should be around 4kg per bhp.

Its easy to dream about, but hard facts are now needed. So I figured out four main Ideas and would like to hear, what do you think about them. Three are bike based, one is V-tec based.
I think bike base is better for my purposes, as the R1 engine weights 70kg less than the B16 engine.


1. R1 front engine rwd:
Plan is to use the engine in longitudinal direction and fit a Hawk driveshaft adapter instead of the chain sprocket. So I’m able zu use a driveshaft that connects to a Luso Motors Reverse box and from that to a Ford Sierra diff. Its basically inspired by the Locost BEC builds. I think I wont have problems with oil pressure, as centrifugal forces while cornering will go the same directions as an accelerating bike.
Main issue is:
What rear axles to use: either self made double wishbone based on mini swivel hubs to fit 10“ rims, or use (expensive) force racing titanium swing arms. I thought about using the MX5 Na rear axle, but it wont fit 10“ wheels.


2. R1 front engine fwd:
I would simply use the Pro-Motive kit. I think its the best way to get huge power and lightweight at the same time. But I heard about grip issues with this fwd version. I also think I will get some problems with losing oil pressure, as a bikes don't „know“ centrifugal forces. Has anyone experiences with this issues?

3. R1 rear engine rwd:
Like z-cars but home made, as z-cars isn't working for a while and the kits are too expensive. This way is my least preferred way to go, because there are too many issues to solve.
How to install a reverse gear? Electrical isn't allowed in Fia rules.
How to make it drivable without „mikey mouses“?
How drivable is it, as the most weight is in the back? Are there traction issues during cornering?


4. B16 front engine fwd:
This is the most common way I think. There are frames ready to buy, but I would weld my own.
Main issue will be the weight of the engine.


I also need some more additional information:

How much weight would a full fibreglass or even carbon fibre front save? Maybe its better to just fit a carbon bonnet, as a full front will warp during cornering?
What wheels should I use? My current Mini is running 6x10“ Wellers, but on bad roads they are a little bit nervous and wobbly. I think 4x10“ alloy would be the best weight wise, but I need grip too. Positive offset would be nice, right? So maybe 4,75“ rose petal or 5“ minilite?

Would be nice, if we could just discuss my thoughts so I can get my own clue. Or maybe someone did something like that already, so I can get a nice overview? There isn't much to find about front engine rwd here in this forum.

Kind regards

By the way: Im german so please forgive my mistakes!
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Old 25-06-2016, 07:13 AM   #2
fuzzy-hair-man
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 27
Default

I wouldn't discount other fwd engines either for example my Nissan CG13DE conversion came in at 630 kg with a full interior and no weight saving bits, the front frame was also over engineered so heavier than it needs to be. So you could get it down to near 600kgs by stripping the interior and some lighter panels? Your power target (125hp) is probably attainable in N/A form but easily attainable in turbo form.

The Toyota 1NZFE is not too much heavier as far as I know is roughly 200cc bigger but a couple that have done conversions have found wiring an issue so aren't running the Toyota ECU, that said I think they were happy, more after market support than the CG13DE I think too.
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